Author Topic: 3xv: Project Phoenix  (Read 165444 times)

Warwick

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Re: 3xv: Project Phoenix
« Reply #135 on: March 11, 2019, 12:12:56 AM »
Good work, Steve. The more grief something gives you, the more satisfying it is when you crack it, eh?

I was going to suggest that you remove the new coating on the end of the shaft for the end bearing, but it looks like you've taken care of that. The dust seals in the end cap might seal better of you smooth down that textured coating in the sealing area too, perhaps?   

Onwards and upwards!  8) (-P)
« Last Edit: March 11, 2019, 12:17:50 AM by Warwick »
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Steveog

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Re: 3xv: Project Phoenix
« Reply #136 on: March 11, 2019, 01:21:58 AM »
Thanks, Warwick. First the countershaft sprocket, then the swinger pivot and now these fookin? bearing sleeves. A real threesome might actually kill me. This threepeat was a true effort, but really satisfying.

Yes. I should have had the bearing seal area on the end of the swinger masked before powder-coating. I don?t know of a tool that can be used to do a precise job of it now. I used a hand-held belt sander to clean the outer surface at the pivot cavity opening, but the powder coat is very tough. (DUH).

Seems a socket-like tool with an abrasive inside surface would be perfect to remove the coating. I just have never seen such a device.

Maybe I can make my own. If you or anyone has an idea, I?m open to ideas.

Here?s to a couple of cold ones. Victory party has already started.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2019, 11:50:45 PM by Steveog »
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James P

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Re: 3xv: Project Phoenix
« Reply #137 on: March 17, 2019, 08:22:56 AM »
...Seems a socket-like tool with an abrasive inside surface would be perfect to remove the coating. I just have never seen such a device.

Maybe I can make my own. If you or anyone has an idea, I?m open to ideas.

Steve,

The 'easy' way for me would be to cut a thin strip of abrasive paper or cloth (of whatever grade you think suitable), about the same width as the length of the sealing surface on the swing arm tube. Loop it around the circumference of the swing arm pivot tube, grasp one end with each hand and gradually work it backwards and forwards all around the tube as required. By using suitable grade abrasive, force and speed, you can gradually remove the powder without going too far. Once you have broken through the powder finish, you may consider changing to a finer grade abrasive to finish off (also consider using WD40, soapy water etc. to keep the abrasive wet as you use it). You may like to cover adjacent parts of the swing arm (on which you want to keep the powder finish) with some durable adhesive tape if there is any likelihood of the abrasive touching it.

A more 'precision' alternative would be to set the swing arm up on a milling machine with the tube oriented vertically in the chuck of a rotary table. Using a cutter of suitable length and small diameter (or small diameter abrasive-band-on-arbor assembly), gradually bring the swing arm closer to the spinning cutter until the powder finish is only just removed, then slowly rotate the swing arm 360 degrees until the same finish is achieved around the entire circumference. There is of course a lot of 'faffing about' involved in setting this up, so you may get an almost equal result by going carefully with the first suggested method!

Let us know how you get on... :)

Regards,
James

Steveog

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Re: 3xv: Project Phoenix
« Reply #138 on: March 17, 2019, 05:41:53 PM »
Good ideas, James. Thank You. I have made a tool from thin wall 46mm (ID) aluminum tubing. The OD of the swingarm pivot is 42mm.

The plan is to hold 200 grit sandpaper in place inside the tubing with rubber strip press-fit by a 32mm, 1/2? drive socket. The socket then serves as the drive for spinning the tool with hand drill and taking off the majority of the coating. The swinger will be held in a vice with rubber end caps to avoid damage.

I have no idea if this will work. The tool is assembled. I will post a picture, later.

Your first method, James would be my fallback. Yes. Masking off the swinger is crucial.

Appreciate you kind wishes. Watch this space.

My best. Steve.

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Steveog

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Re: 3xv: Project Phoenix
« Reply #139 on: March 17, 2019, 10:39:49 PM »
James and All. Made good progress on the swinger today. My OTO tool works, but the power coating clogs the 200 grit sand paper quickly. Had to tear it apart and re-load the abrasive three (3) times. Believe the pictures will tell the story. The end cap seal fits tight and moves freely, but the job is only about 90% finished.

After the first pass with the coarse abrasive, I then used a 180 grit Dremel polishing tool to clean it up further. Everyone knows how long those Dremel attachments last. I burned up the only two I had getting to what you see here.

Big problem solved, now just a trip to town tomorrow for 4-5 Dremel Attachments and I can move on.

Thanks for your ideas and interest in my project.

Steve
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ybk

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Re: 3xv: Project Phoenix
« Reply #140 on: March 18, 2019, 12:45:59 AM »
I've always just used paint stripper to remove powder coat from unmasked areas. I thought it wouldn't work but it just bubbled up the power coat same as any other paint. Using a tiny brush I did detailed removal.. (maybe my powder coating was crap? or the paint stripper I used was bad ass..it was a gel type)

Steveog

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Re: 3xv: Project Phoenix
« Reply #141 on: March 18, 2019, 02:33:13 AM »
Good suggestion to clean up the powder coating that remains, Karl. The guys who did my PC did a great job. Their stuff was a bitch to attack. (Of course, it was my error in not asking for proper masking in the first place.)

After blasting, they kept open the chain adjustment marks and the VIN number. Outstanding customer service. Their owner is a veteran flat-tracker.

Their coating was so good, I�ve since splashed brake cleaner on it with no impact.

Thanks for the tip, though. Paint remover is a lot cheaper and far less of an engineering excercise than Dremel attachments and my homemade tool.

I�ll just ask for the �secret death formula� paint stripper. If it doesn�t work, I�ve got a backup plan ready.

Thanks, again.

Steve

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Steveog

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Re: 3xv: Project Phoenix
« Reply #142 on: March 22, 2019, 10:11:52 PM »
I've been out of the shop for few days. Tried ybk's idea for removing unwanted powder coating. Worked as advertised. Many Thanks. Much easier than trying to carefully grind it off.

My only problem is I was so happy with my invention. (HA).

As you can see in the pics there was some scarring on the side revealed by paint/epoxy stripper. After scraping the coating off, I Used a Dremel polishing tool, attempting to clean it up. The other side looks nicer. As you can see the end cap for left side had been damaged sometime back in Jurassic Era. That's probably responsible for water getting into the bearings, bushing and buggering up the swingers outer most end surface.

The last pic shows a new end cap in place. It fits just as it should.

Thanks again for a great solution to my problem. Moving on to assembling the chassis.

Steve
« Last Edit: March 22, 2019, 11:46:44 PM by Steveog »
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James P

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Re: 3xv: Project Phoenix
« Reply #143 on: March 23, 2019, 10:45:15 AM »
Glad you got it sorted Steve. Thanks to Karel for the suggestion to use paint stripper for removing powder coating - I wouldn't have thought it would work either, but can't argue with testimony from two independent sources! Must try it when opportunity arises...

Regards,
James

Steveog

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Re: 3xv: Project Phoenix
« Reply #144 on: March 23, 2019, 04:47:19 PM »
Thanks, James. I went with ybk?s suggestion, figuring, ?what the hell?? That and I trusted his expertise.

The paint stripper I used was a gel-type that promised to work on Epoxy as well as paint. I only let it cure for about an hour before the first picture. It took a variety of typical hand tools to finish up the surface. Pocket knife, utility knife, pointed pick, 200 grit sand paper and the Dremel with slightly abrasive polishing drum.

That?s gaffer tape used to mask. It doesn?t leave residue and the stripper didn?t dissolve it. It?s not cheap, but guarantees against overslop.

I may have to do this again. The mounting points for the shock linkage is covered with powder coat.

Thanks for your interest and encouragement.
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Steveog

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Re: 3xv: Project Phoenix
« Reply #145 on: March 24, 2019, 11:40:31 PM »
Lots of good news. A bit of mind fog on my part though kept today's session from being perfect.

Started pulling one of the two swing-arm bearings into place selecting the side that had suffered the most over the years and the necessary, but brutal disassembly process. I decided to use the axle as the threaded puller, figuring its made of high-grade steel and has a tight thread pattern, making each movement more precise. Good Idea. Another good idea was coating the bearing's outer skin with Permatex, Anti-Seize compound.

I'm slowly cranking the bearing in place. Things were going so well, I forgot that axle had a limited number of threads, so when the going got tough (the axle nut had grounded out), I just thought that it was a bit of deformation down in the swinger's cavity. So, I broke out my trusty breaker-bar and laid into it. No joy. Broke out the heat gun. Still nothing moved. About this time, I tapped on the end of the axle nearest to the bearing and it and the bearing budged a bit. A very dim light bulb goes of in my head.

Now, I had realized what dumb-ass means.

Tried to remove the axle lock nut to take the puller apart and just tap home the bearing. "Nothing is ever fucking easy". It took Kroil, a propane torch and breaker bar to release the lock nut. I believe the threads on the nut are now damaged, as removing it took way to much effort. The bolt threads are OK.

Back to the good news. It was now easy to tap the bearing home using a thin washer and a 22mm socket. Job done. So was I.

On the other side, I'm going to use the same puller rig, get the bearing squared away about half way into the cavity, tear the puller apart, heat the swinger and tap the bearing in place with the washer/socket.

Yamaha is to be commended for their 30 year-old casting technology. My swinger has taken a real beating and is still rock-solid.

PS - I'll be acquiring a tight threaded rod from my bearing guys, soon.
« Last Edit: March 25, 2019, 05:06:00 PM by Steveog »
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Warwick

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Re: 3xv: Project Phoenix
« Reply #146 on: March 25, 2019, 12:21:38 AM »
If you put the bearing in the freezer for a few hours and heat up the arm a bit, they should slide in pretty easy with a bit of grease to help them on their way, Steve. There's no need to over-complicate things or use excessive force. I just used a length of plain 8mm threaded rod with washers and nuts to pull them in. Easy.  ?:-|
« Last Edit: March 25, 2019, 12:34:24 AM by Warwick »
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Steveog

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Re: 3xv: Project Phoenix
« Reply #147 on: March 25, 2019, 01:57:53 AM »
Yes. I knew how the physics work and would have done as you suggested, if the puller wasn?t working. There seemed to be no reason to wait for freezing the bearings. And there it is. I will be unable to work on the bike much in the next 10 days. I wanted to mount the bearings today.

What I should have done with my rig, was to cut another, longer piece of PVC to assist in pulling the bearing all the way home.

I posted my lapse of judgement as a warning to others who don?t have quite the experience as you and others here, but do have instincts they trust. They may also have motivation to towards impatience. That is where you?re screwed almost every time.

I plan to ?sweat? all the engine bearings into place. Will now do the same (just heat gun, no oven) on the other swinger bearing.

This is much like using paint stripper to clean off unwanted powder coat. I read the entire current Forum and not once did I encounter any suggestions...except for my project (with practical ideas from James and an unexpected solution from ybk.)

Experience = Knowledge earned through trial, failure, preservence and finally, success.

Thanks, as always, for sharing your experience. My best to you for your advise, admonishments and encouragements.

PS - Based on my experience, I recommend the ?anti-seize? lubricant over simple oil or grease.

« Last Edit: March 25, 2019, 02:12:59 AM by Steveog »
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Steveog

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Re: 3xv: Project Phoenix
« Reply #148 on: March 27, 2019, 08:00:46 PM »
My problems with the swing-arm pivot started on January 21st. Today, all-new pivot bearings, pivot bushing, SP thrust bearings, end cap/seals are installed and ready to mount back to the frame. The pivot bolt has been cleaned, polished and slathered with anti-seize grease. Only the pivot shaft nut needs replacing, but I can move forward with the old one, while waiting.

If you put the bearing in the freezer for a few hours and heat up the arm a bit, they should slide in pretty easy with a bit of grease to help them on their way, Steve.

Yes, Warwick. The second Bearing slipped right in. Requiring only a light tap to set in place. Thank You, again.

Business will now keep me out of the shop for 8 days. The engine will then be my primary focus.

I'll probably miss the first track day with the TZR, but my teammate has graciously offered to share his super-stock ZX-6R and/or "Built" EX-400 track bike for the 4/20 due date.

Stay tuned.
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Steveog

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Re: 3xv: Project Phoenix
« Reply #149 on: March 29, 2019, 11:04:09 PM »
A bit at a time. Pressed the new bearings and seals into the suspension linkage. Used anti-seize compound on both. Moly grease on bearings and bushings, more anti-seize on the bolts and nuts.

The action of the linkage is very smooth. Very satisfying.

All nuts are finger tight at the moment, as I'm not confident that I had all the proper washers in the first place. When I disassembled the bike, I carefully put all sub-assemblies together in labeled plastic bags. I even separated the linkage (dog-bone) that attaches to the swinger from that which mounts to the chassis and shock. I'm going back into my pictures for clarification. Any of you know where I can get a more specific guide, beyond the parts drawings or maintenance manuals? I know that's a bit vague, but anything you might know would help.

If I can't solve this, I'll give more details.

Steve

 
« Last Edit: March 30, 2019, 02:20:09 AM by Steveog »
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