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Mr stinkwheels Group: Members Posts: 206 Joined: May 2006 Posted: Aug. 25 2006,18:15 Well I have just got back from the second dyno run on my 3XV. I have just run in the engine after a top end rebuild and re-plated pots. Since the last run I have corrected the carburation and had the pots Stan Stephens stage 2 tuned. Still running the Lomas pipes. The blue line is the dual cdi setup -00 and -70. The red line is the standard -00 cdi. Have a look, compare it with the first dyno run and tell me what you think. Back to top

Warwickb Group: Members Posts: 1911 Joined: Sep. 2003 Posted: Aug. 25 2006,20:58 That looks really good Martin. Much more linear than before, and the common 3XV dip near the top is effectively gone. That tallies with how it felt to ride, too. On stock bikes you can feel the power drop/flatten off near the top before giving a little more at the very top on most (for some reason they don't all do this though - effectively giving a low RPM peak (about 9.5k) and then a drop off like the -70 CDI one above) It's a bit of a shame the dyno place doesn't measure from the wheel though as that would make it more directly compararable with others. However it must still be quite a bit over 50 at the wheel, isn't it? (I don't know what the drive-train losses are). The Stevens tune, freshen up and the carb fettling have certainly improved it tho', so they were worth the work/money I'd say. It's a Very nice 3XV curve indeed. How are they taking the feed for the revs, tho? Either they are doing it wrong or there is more in waiting, as they will usually peak around a true 11k (or a little over) - yours is showing peak at just over 10 . For me this kind of thing is really adding fuel to the idea that the 3XV-00 CDI is just not 'restricted' in the way we have long thought. Excellent work, Martin. When do you want to meet up so that we can do a better back to back comparison? It could provide useful development data, I'd think. Mine was only giving 46 on the Dyna-pro dyno, but I think it would read a bit higher on a non dyna-pro rig. Of course this means that you have to get it on the track now! Trust me, you would waste an R6/GSXR etc. unless they had a very good jocky on board - they were literally getting in my way up on Anglesey at the w/end - and I have very minimal track experience and very little natural aptitude (I'm keen, mind ) so it was more the bike's doing than mine. I might be doing another one at Llandow in Sept' if you fancy it? Rgds Wb -------------- A garage overflowing with old stinkers... Back to top

Mr stinkwheels Group: Members Posts: 206 Joined: May 2006 Posted: Aug. 25 2006,21:36 Hi Warwick. The dyno guy said rear wheel bhp is @ 15% less than crank so take off about 6.5 bhp leaves me with just over 52 bhp at the rear wheel. He was very impressed with the performance of the -00 cdi, and was telling me about RGV 250 and Aprilia RS 250 he has tested. The best std RGV he has seen was 56 at the crank. The best played with RGV he has seen was 64 at the crank. The best std RS 250 he has seen was 61 at the crank. The best very played with RS 250 he has seen was 70 at the crank. It would be interesting to see what the -70 cdi goes like on your TZ/SP 3XV, as I am sure the TZ ports would suit the box. I am interested in a track day some time....just need to get loads of bubble wrap and protection mushrooms and those stabilizers.hehe. Keep me informed on the Llandow in Sept'  thing. Regards Martin Back to top

Warwickb Group: Members Posts: 1911 Joined: Sep. 2003 Posted: Aug. 25 2006,22:44 Lol. Knowing that you really don't want to bin it is half the fun - 'just how hard dare I push it?' . Makes you feel like a winner every time you come back into the pits with the panels in one piece! If you are really worried, ARD do fibreglass for the 125R - straight bolt on for the 3XV, or you could fit Chinasteve's TZ stuff with his magic brakets? Or just go naked? I run a 4DP-10 box on the TZ/SP, but one of the reasons I am really beginning to question the 'restricted' nature of the 3XV-00 box is that Geoff (Gbowie) seems to be having some excellent results runing a 3YL top end with a 3XV-00 CDI. I will try my -00 box on the TZ/SP when I finally get the crank sorted in that one. Did you see the experiments me and James did with different boxes? - printouts on the Krazy Katt site. Quite illuminating. Sadly we didn't have a -70 box, but we did have the -80 Did the dyno guy plot the suzuki motor scan against yours though? I'd bet yours was 5-8 bhp stronger all the way through the midrange. Those Suzuki motors are bloody hard work 'in the real world'. My priller hasn't been put of the garage this summer, whereas it was all hands to the pump when the 3XV broke. That speaks volumes to me. I'll let you know if there are still places on the Llandow day... You know you wanna Cheers Wb -------------- A garage overflowing with old stinkers... Back to top

gbowie Two stroke spirit Group: Members Posts: 264 Joined: May 2006 Posted: Aug. 26 2006,09:44 Ok, I have been dying to post this and I guess this is about the time. This is a stock TZR 3XV "R" with wet clutch. It runs 3YL top ends and SP crank..34mm carbs. The ignition is bog standard 3XV-00 with not even an advancer key, I is fully road legal with full electrics. As you can see, it revs freely to 13k with the std box. http://s65.photobucket.com/albums....lip.flv -------------- You'll live a lot longer if you give up the things that make life worth living ! Back to top

jools Group: Members Posts: 1221 Joined: Oct. 2005 Posted: Aug. 26 2006,10:26 you couldn't resist it could you geoff !!! Thats the Chesterfield Special isn't it ?? -------------- "The only thing worse than being talked about is not being talked about...." oscar Wilde Back to top

Mr stinkwheels Group: Members Posts: 206 Joined: May 2006 Posted: Aug. 26 2006,10:37 Hi Geoff. Thats impressive stuff. Back to top

gbowie Two stroke spirit Group: Members Posts: 264 Joined: May 2006 Posted: Aug. 26 2006,18:34 Yes Jools, but really it's the yellow 3XV racer with the tank, plastic bits lights, plates and disc transplanted so it can be used on the road, it makes it a whole lot easier for getting the jetting right and testing advancer keys etc. as the motor is still in the development stage. Otherwise we would have to wait for track days. Therefore the frame No. does not tally with the license disc.. a chance we have to take. Other than the totally illegal exhust noise. -------------- You'll live a lot longer if you give up the things that make life worth living ! Back to top

James H Group: Members Posts: 85 Joined: Mar. 2006 Posted: Aug. 27 2006,09:25 Are you running stock TZ compression on regular pump fuel? -------------- The search for knowledge can easily turn into hair loss! www.krazy-katt.com Back to top

gbowie Two stroke spirit Group: Members Posts: 264 Joined: May 2006 Posted: Aug. 27 2006,14:17 Stock compression..0.7mm squish but 103 octane racing fuel and Motol 800 premix. ( expensive !) -------------- You'll live a lot longer if you give up the things that make life worth living ! Back to top

gbowie Two stroke spirit Group: Members Posts: 264 Joined: May 2006 Posted: Aug. 27 2006,14:18 Forgot to mention..it is Leaded racing fuel. -------------- You'll live a lot longer if you give up the things that make life worth living ! Back to top

tzrzbrian Group: Members Posts: 10 Joined: May 2006 Posted: Sep. 17 2006,03:55 Whats with the Sugo Box lacking HP on the Top? Anybody know why they do this?? Why run the 2 if the -00 runs that good on its own?? Interesting stuff.................................. Back to top

Mr stinkwheels Group: Members Posts: 206 Joined: May 2006 Posted: Sep. 17 2006,13:14 Not realy sure why the sugo box drops off @ 9500. There have been suggestions that the R porting does not match the -70 cdi, but I am not sure, I am no expert, I was just trying things out. I had the R cylinders Stan Stephens tuned for this second dyno run, which gave a good increase on the standard cdi, but very little difference on the -70 cdi. I do not know how much difference there is between a R -00 cylinder, and the SP -10 cylinder, but can it make that much difference? I would be interested to see a dyno run on a TZ barrelled TZR useing the -70 to find out if it will rev on with power. Has anyone tried this yet? I know gbowie has a 3YL top end with -00 cdi and that goes like a bat out of he ll. So the -00 works well with standard ports and race spec ports, so surely the -70 should work with both too? Any answers would be good. Back to top

gbowie Two stroke spirit Group: Members Posts: 264 Joined: May 2006 Posted: Sep. 17 2006,13:55 Send me a 70 box and I'll try it ! Maybe we can trade, I have a neat pair of carbon stingers, plus plenty of other 3XV motor parts !! -------------- You'll live a lot longer if you give up the things that make life worth living ! Back to top

tzrzbrian Group: Members Posts: 10 Joined: May 2006 Posted: Sep. 18 2006,04:10 I have a -70 and a -80 box my bike lit up the minute I put it on? (the -70) The midrange cleaned up and it would pull to 10500. I just switched to the -10 cylinders with TZ reeds and plugged off the boost bottles and it flat out rips now even running the standard 28 MM carbs and wet clutch. I have a full TYGA MC21 that used to walk all over the Yamaha but not any more. The transfer ports are much different on the -10 cylinders and the exhaust ports are much higher. The Exhaust valves are totally different (not interchangeable) as well. The heads are a much better design with anti detonation ring and much more coolant flow.I was going to use a tz top end and was advised against it so I went this route. This is a street bike. I am very happy with it now. The -10 top end is was very hard to find. Glowbie what do you want for those cans? You don't happen to have a set of SP cases with clutch do you? I have a crank. Back to top

jools Group: Members Posts: 1221 Joined: Oct. 2005 Posted: Sep. 18 2006,08:41 i found once I ported the R cyclinder to SP spec the motor would pull way past 9500 up to 13000. This indicates to me that the -70 is no good with the stock cylinders. I have the dyno run booked for this Sat and i will see what the difference is. i know I have a midrange problem with the carbs but I'm hoping to try some weaker needles and nozzles for the run. i'll let you guys know the outcome. PS the dimensions on the porting map for the SP given elsewhere in this forum are not measured correctly according to the guy tuning my motor - dimensions for ex port opening/height make it open earlier than a TZ !! The transfers look dodgy too. -------------- "The only thing worse than being talked about is not being talked about...." oscar Wilde Back to top

gbowie Two stroke spirit Group: Members Posts: 264 Joined: May 2006 Posted: Sep. 18 2006,20:10 Sorry tzrbrian, I'd kill for SP bits, all my spares are R parts, the cans really aren't for sale, but will certainly go as part payment on a -70 box. -------------- You'll live a lot longer if you give up the things that make life worth living ! Back to top

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