Did this last summer, along with my leg and collar bone:
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I've stripped the bodywork and had it placed in my Swiss vault. Some pictures with her kit off and a new Yamaha (but earlier year) brake lever:
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Next items on the list are repacking the end cans and new o-rings for the slip-on headers. I'll be sharing my good fortune in my next update, I'm just waiting for delivery of a couple of things ;)
Many thanks to Paul for giving me the impetus to do something.
Good luck this one....
A good friend has ruined his freshly rebuild rz500 with an RZV500 alloy frame on her fisrt track day... I think it takes him 3 years before he was able to work on the bike :( :(
Nothing but minor flesh wounds there, Yan. Be right as rain in no time :).
The stock cans are a mechanical baffle though; they have no packing, and can't easily be taken apart. I have a 3XV9 stock silencer somewhere. Do you want me to check the condition if you are looking to replace the scuffed one?
The pipe headers just use a common copper ring gasket to seal, no O rings. I found these could be re-used many times, and usually a simple quick tweak of the nuts will cure any leaks at the manifold in any case. More simple fixes :)
I have a set of new Chinese bodywork here in the red/white 50th anniversary colours. I want to keep the seat unit as I had them make me a single unit, but You can have the head/sides and V piece for £180 if you want them?
I agree. Nothing too serious. Can be fixed relatively cheap and Warwick has most the gear.
The crucial thing is to get them back on the road the quickest easiest and cheapest way.
I can sense a bit more of a project bike with this one in the future maybe?
Warwick, thanks for the offer, I will have it if you can find it to put in the loft for the restro in 15 years time. I will have a think about the bodywork.
I'm going to be swapping the standard exhausts for a pair of Jackals(?). They need the end cans re-wadding and the pipes slip onto round headers which need new o-rings:
http://pure2strokespirit.net/forums/index.php?topic=635.msg6641#msg6641 (http://pure2strokespirit.net/forums/index.php?topic=635.msg6641#msg6641)
OK. Understand about the pipes now. I'll have a look for the can. No worries either way about the bodywork. Just thought I'd offer as you'd mentioned it in another post and I have it sitting around doing nothing at the moment. I bought it for a project that I've postponed for the time-being. It'll doubtless get used at some point though.
A couple of hours in the shed and yours could be back on the road no problem I reckon.
Quick! While the suns out. Before the summer rainy season commences... :)
I've only managed a bit so far due to a family bereavement but everything has settled down and I've got a weekend planned in the garage.
I have managed to repack the end cans. I got two sheets of 350mmx500mmx10mm of wadding which trimmed down to 300mm off eBay. I thought I would need to trim the length but I managed to stuff it all in. A squirt of pound shop ptfe spray in the cans held slide it in. I got a dozen 4.8mmx10mm pop rivets from my fastener supplier (http://www.allcap.co.uk/ (http://www.allcap.co.uk/)) for a shocking £1.50. Allcap have a warehouse full of every fastener you could think of and have an old school trade counter and guys who "know".
As the next plan is to strip the carbs and dry fit the new exhausts I've been on a mission to buy gaskets. Firstly I've discovered the 3XV exhaust gasket (~£10) is superseded by the 350YPVS exhaust gasket which is much cheaper. The cheapest and most trusted source came from Norbo (http://homepage.ntlworld.com/ultimatelccrazy/ (http://homepage.ntlworld.com/ultimatelccrazy/)) at £18 for six delivered.
The new pipes have slip-on headers and the o-rings that came with them where shot. Allcap couldn't help but they put me on the a local bearing and belting shop (http://www.acbelting.co.uk/). These "okies" are even more old school with a shop that's a cross between Open All Hours and Coronation Street. They spent a while measuring up the slip-on header and as they don't hold o-rings in stock got their rep to drop of some regular o-ring samples to try for fit. We tried the samples with the header and pipe and settled on BS222. They ordered me four Viton ones and charged me £5. Fantastic service from guys that care but they will try to sell you a tractor PTO.
Finally I've got myself a heated ultrasonic cleaner and some "carb solution" from Allendale Ultrasonics (http://www.allendale-ultrasonics.co.uk/ (http://www.allendale-ultrasonics.co.uk/)). I'll report back with how I get on (and before I offer to do other peoples...).
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Nice work Yan. It's great when you find proper old school enthusiast type suppliers innit?
I found the oe type exhaust gaskets a bit too thick and bulky with the Jackal flanges, so I made simple, fibre gaskets from thick gasket paper - a simple round one instead of the oe copper gasket, and then a kind of diamond shaped one with stud holes punched in to seal the outside of the flange to the cyl. They worked very well, so it might be worth thinking about if you too find the oe copper rings a bit thick, making the flanges stand too proud of the cyl?
Nice post Yan. Reminds me of the high standards set by steve which had us glued to our screens every night hoping for an update.
What size ultrasonic did you get? Got a mind to bring some carbies when I come visit.
Thanks for the advice Warwick, I will try to remember it when they don't fit.
It's 1.2l Paul, but heated which is the trick. Your welcome to bring carbs for cleaning when you try to get your SP crank off me... ;D
Back to today's trials and tribulations. I got the airboxes off and the filters are in good nick. I will clean and oil them anyway as I have some "filter oil spray" and they are off. I have taken the left/upper carb off and cleaned it in the tank today. I'll post some before and afters once it is back together but it's done a good job. I have posted a picture of the stuffed "carb filter" and what came out of it. I did the "epoxy fuel tap filter fix" (thanks Warwick) last year but this must have been carp built up before that.
On the worrying side is what I found behind the right/lower airbox. The bottom corner of the airbox was a bit oily and thinking back that fairing panel had a little bit of oil on it. The bikes a '93 RS and has the "solenoid" oil pump. If you look on the picture below you will see that the oil line from the oil pump to the right/lower solenoid is cracked and this must be where it was loosing oil.
I've not felt the bike "nip up" at all and I think it is only a small leak. The right/lower exhaust was smoking and looking at the restriction in the carb filter I don't think it was ever making serious ponies. I've looked at the parts book for that bit of pipe and on Cmsnl its 5 euro but NLA. I was thinking of getting some of the clear oil lines and clips from Norbo. Has anyone got any experience or advice (I'm keeping the oil pump and airboxes for the minute Paul ;))
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Having just been out and looking at the brass tube it looks like it was bent when I came off. I have very gingerly straightened it up enough to get a new line on/off.
I've no experience of the later solenoid pumps, but I think the line bleeding procedure is a little bit more involved than with the straightforward pump isn't it? If there's enough length on the split hose, a simple trim and re-fit job might be the most straightforward fix? Failing that, any suitable size oil resistant hose will do the job.
I've not done the bleed before but Wullie did warn me about it. I have a roughly translated version from a Japanese site translated in a PDF. There are lots of steps and think you have to wait for the moon to be in the right quarter at one point.
The original pipe is too short to trim/reuse so I will get some clear line from Norbo. If I'm going to have to bleed it I might as well put clear lines throughout.
yambits do clear lines if you're stuck, which i doubt!!
thats a lot of crap in that little filter.
I've managed to clean the carbs and fit the clear oil feed lines. Everything takes longer than you think and you find more stuff to do/fix/replace as you go.
The ultrasonic cleaner did the business and if you are looking to get one I would recommend going for a heated one and the pro cleaning solutions. The upper carb smelt like something had died in it when I opened it up so as an experiment I sprayed the carb body with half a tin of pound shop carb cleaner. It looked really good after and I was a bit miffed about shelling out £60 for a cleaner and solution. I put it in the tank and the solution went as brown/nasty as the un-sprayed one. My inner Northerner calmed down a bit after this as the money wasn't a waste after all. The carb screws had been butched/flat-head-cut by a previous owner so I popped down to Alcap and got ten allen-key headed bolts for £2.40 (M4, 0.70mm pitch, 14mm length). They look a lot nicer now.
I got my clear line from Norbo and have replaced all the original oil feed lines. The clear stuff from Norbo is the same inside diameter but has a larger outer diameter. I managed to re-use the metal clips but I had to stretch them a bit with some long nose pliers. The original lines were snapping, cracking and falling to pieces when I was taking them off. If you are still running original oil feed lines I would seriously recommend changing them. I'm not the World's best mechanic but I managed it and I reckon you could do it in about two hours including taking off the bodywork and airboxes. If you have a '93 onwards solenoid set-up you will need about 60cm of line all told. Norbo is happy to sell you single lengths; it's the same stuff as he sells for the 250/350LC. If you are worried about your original lines then buy some replacement line BEFORE you inspect yours as mine were cracking/splitting with only a casual sideways glance.
I've not bled the oil-pump but I will post a separate write up when I do with all the required mystical incantations, correct type of incense and the virgin's phone number.
If anyone wants replacement carb bolts let me know, I'm happy to do them at cost plus postage. Same goes for ultrasonic cleaning carbs; they work out at about £3 each (plus postage etc) (I'll whine if they're not stripped so beware...).
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I'm also quite pleased with my ultrasonic cleaner - some solution + the heater and it becomes a very effective parts washer! I'm putting anything that will fit in there 8)
Good luck with the bleeding! Looking at the manual you'll probably need the stars to align as well ;) ;D
Nice when a plan comes together
If you're not careful summer will be over so get it running, ride it and further your strict requirements in winter.. YOLO my kids say.
Haha I think your the oldest person in the world to use that phrase Paul ;D
BA Barakas was older than me!
Okay but it's never too late to realize you only live once
With Paul's chiding still fresh in my ears I went out to do a bit on the bike today. I kinda wish I hadn't.
Firstly, star of the week is Dan Maccas, thanks Dan (twice).
Today's task was to set the powervalves. I put the battery on charge and removed the left/upper exhaust. Armed with Dan's instructions on setting powervalves (*) I put the battery on the bike only to realise it's just a bit shagged. No lights on the bike and only 6V after an hour on charge, so I put it back on (up to 9V now...). No worries I thought, I will dry fit the new exhausts like Dan told me to (**).
I had a look up into the cylinder and noticed there was a couple of very light scores in the barrel on the carb side. Bugger. Next I tried the flange and the studs don't line up :(. The headers I have (that I spent the time getting O-rings for) have symmetrical holes across the diameter of the exhaust and the R/RS ones are offset and by the looks of it at different distance from the exhaust. I removed the studs and checked that the exhaust fitted and by the looks of it it does.
Next I moved onto the right/lower cylinder. One of the stud nuts wouldn't come off and rounded so I spent the next hour with the PluGas, Clarke rotary tool and a punch & hammer. While taking a breather I noticed some light rust spots on the right fork stanchion which must have been from gravel flicked up when I came off. Bollocks. I cleaned it up with some Brasso and put some of that Scotoil corrosion inhibitor on it.
When I finally got the exhaust off I confirmed that the header was unsuitable for the other side ( I guessed that way). Undeterred I offered up the RHS exhaust only to discover that the hanger bracket is absolutely no where it needs to be, and is actually nearer the footrest bolt than the hanger. Tw*t.
Ready for the final kicking I had a look into the cylinder (the one that is feed from the oil line that was broken) and the piston was coated in 2T oil and the barrel surface was mint. (Slight) hurrah!
Before I tried the RHS exhaust I was considering getting the headers either modified or some new ones made up. Now I really don't know what to do. I'm looking forward to telling my wife I've spent £400 on not much more than a few old cat food tins. Dan told me that someone else was looking at those pipes when I got them (Gary?) and was miffed that they missed them. Count your lucky stars that it wasn't you.
Anywise, these were the pipes so if anyone has any suggestions please let me know http://pure2strokespirit.net/forums/index.php?topic=635.msg6641#msg6641 (http://pure2strokespirit.net/forums/index.php?topic=635.msg6641#msg6641). I'm kinda wishing I had written the bike off last year instead of looking to fix it.
I'm also very not happy with the guy who sold me the pipes as DFR 3XV pipes. It might have been an "honest mistake" but I've often heard the expression "make it someone else's problem".
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Hmmm.
Can you measure the stud centres on both the flanges and the cylinder yan? Maybe the 3xv30 cylinders have a different spacing to 00 cylinders? Someone with 00 cylinders would have to confirm as i don't have one. Does seem very odd though.
I might be able to get some flanges made up for you if we canascertain exactly what it is we need? I could rapid prototype one out of plastic first to make sure it's correct.
Dan
I wonder if they are 3ma flanges. Not 3ma jackal flanges as they only have one spring loop but they could be off a different make 3ma pipe. I have a 3ma jackal flange in uni so can measure it tomorrow!
Dan
3xv00 cylinder stud spacing is 79mm( centre to centre of each stud), either the 3xv30 cylinders are different or the flanges are for some other model?
I understand the frustration, bought dfr pipes and stored them for a year, tried installing them and turned out I got sp pipes and flanges >:( was advertised incorrectly!
At least the flange exit is straight, should be easy to have some made (dfr ones are all angled which is a little more tricky to remake). Shame about the hangers though :(
I can confirm that -00 and -30 cyls are the same.
Probs little comfort for you just now Jan, but your experiences here are not at all unusual I'd say. Modding is seldom as straightforward as it all looks once the job is finished. Keep at it. You'll work it all out eventually I'm sure :).
Cheers Warwick. That eliminates that then.
Dan
Thanks for the assistance Dan and the sage advice Warwick.
I have made the measurements and they are below with a picture of the "Yamaha" exhaust manifold. I checked both heads and they are cast 3XV-50. I checked both barrels and they are cast 3XV-30. I checked the "Yamaha" pipes and they are stamped 3XV1-1 and 3XV1-2. I checked my glasses and my vernier callipers and they both looked straight. These puppies are neither in the plane of symmetry nor symetrical. Some of my measurements might not be bang on but not by that much.
Quote3xv00 cylinder stud spacing is 79mm
The collars (and pipes, except for the RHS mount (maybe?)) might fit on a 3XV-00 cylinder then?1!?!
I'm off to check the parts book as this is more surreal than the Healing Field at the Glastenbury Festival.....
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Keep at it Yanw we all have shit days but you will sort it just don't let it get to you.
Have a cupa and start at it again it will work out good luck ;)
Quote from: stevewr250 on May 18, 2014, 09:53:55 PM
Keep at it Yanw we all have shit days but you will sort it just don't let it get to you.
Have a cupa and start at it again it will work out good luck ;)
Thanks Steve, after what I have read and seen I'm thinking it's not me, it's Mr Yamaha...
Well, I checked the parts book and it shows the "Yamaha" pipes are the same item across the whole R/RS 91-94 range. It's odd as the "Yamaha" collars have to be on the pipes before they are welded. They didn't look like they had been off the bike and along with the crush gaskets there was lots of black silicon. Was that a factory fitment/sealant?
The headers definitely match the barrels and the barrels show no sign of reworking or drilling. (I'm getting tempted to JB Weld them up and get them re-drilled...)
Wullie has a 93RS, I wonder if he had issues with pipes?
I think it's just that the flanges you got with the jackal pipes are wrong for a 3xv. I reckon they are 3ma flanges yan. I'll measure a flange i have kicking about first thing tomorrow for you. The good news is that if they are for a 3ma then they are at least desirable so you should be able to sell them on fairly easily.
Does anyone have any detailed pictures of R model 3xv Jackal flanges?
Dan
Can't really follow your post there, Yan? but you know the Yam flanges only fit one way round don't you?
As mentioned, -00 and -30 cyls are identical in terms of casting and exhaust fitment. Pipes that fit any R/RS will fit any other.
Your set-up looks completely stock to me.
Yes, the black gasket goo is the oe Yam stuff. Don't know what it is, but it must be bloody good, because it seems very heat/oil resistant.
Quote from: Warwick on May 18, 2014, 10:15:57 PM
Can't really follow your post there, Yan? but you know the Yam flanges only fit one way round don't you?
I mis-read the picture that Dan took and thought that his barrel had the studs across the plane of the exhaust exit. My bad for jumping to conclusions.
Quote from: Warwick on May 18, 2014, 10:15:57 PM
Yes, the black gasket goo is the oe Yam stuff. Don't know what it is, but it must be bloody good, because it seems very heat/oil resistant.
I guessed as much as the nuts didn't look like they had been off (unlike the carbs).
Quote from: Warwick on May 18, 2014, 10:15:57 PM
Your set-up looks completely stock to me.
Cool. I will need to get some headers made up then. The LHS exhaust fits to a frame bracket but the RHS fits to the footrest hanger. I wonder if they are designed to fit "Jackal" rearsets?
Shame Yan. You have had a rough time with this lot.
Do you want to send me your barrels for a slight tune
You can owe me a carb clean.
Aftermarket rearsets generally leave the exhaust hangar points in the same place as oe.
The upper cyl pipe will generally line up with the rear hangar point more easily as the physical position of the header affects the rear hanger point less than with the lower cyl pipe. The fact that your lower cyl pipe doesn't line up at the rear suggests to me that (and I'm speculating here of course) either it's proper flange piece should be deeper to push the pipe further back, or that they are SP pipes, designed for use with the oe cyl adapter piece in position - which would do the same thing with a slimmer flange?
I have some R type Jackal flanges here somewhere. I can try to root them out if you think it might help?
Just measured a 3ma jackal flange and the measurements tie in with the flanges you have Yan. 74mm hole centres and the holes are centred with the exhaust bore. Inner diameter of central hole is is 37mm though rather than the 33mm you mention. Possibly 2ma flanges maybe? Anyway they aren't for a 3xv that's for sure.
Can you mount the pipes on their mounts at the back of the bike without the flanges fitted and take pictures of how far the header pipes are away from the cylinders?
I reckon you just need 3xv R model jackal flanges. The pipes look to be R model jackals from other pictures i've seen.
Dan
Quote from: maccas on May 19, 2014, 09:46:04 AM
Can you mount the pipes on their mounts at the back of the bike without the flanges fitted and take pictures of how far the header pipes are away from the cylinders?
I will do this tonight when I get home from work.
Quote from: Paul on May 19, 2014, 08:59:19 AM
Do you want to send me your barrels for a slight tune
You can owe me a carb clean.
I'll see if I can get it to run again before I take the barrels off Paul, otherwise it will be even longer before I get a go. As for the carbs just send them to me and I'll do them, you can pay me back at some point in the future. Remember I still have your SP crank (thinking about it do you really want me to open my engine while I still have your crank? >:D)
Hahahaha
OK, pictures of the gaps as requested. It looks like, to get them straight, that there is about a 3" gap.
Has anyone else had/fitted SP Tadao Jackals to their 3XV?
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Has anyone else on the forum fitted Sp Tadho Jackals? It looks like the headers would need to be 3" long at least.
Any advice or pics would be great as Paul is hassling me to go to the dyno with him.
I still don't know if these expansion chambers are for a TZR. RGV maybe?
I agree with macca. Where are your manifold adaptors ? Cast aluminium things about 3 inches long ;)
The problem is Peter that the manifolds I got with the pipes are not right. The stud spacing and positioning is wrong (and the length too). I'm trying to work out what I can do with them but have little experience and nothing to reference.
Yan,
Can you take some more pictures of the pipes please? I think I might have spotted some subtle differences compared to the pics of Jackals I have seen.
Here is what I have noticed. I have placed red arrows where the welds are. First your pipes:
(https://pure2strokespirit.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi189.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fz125%2Fmaccas125%2FSPtadao_zps5fd4623b.png&hash=d09a95cec08164fcb8173e3263984eaf5974d974) (http://s189.photobucket.com/user/maccas125/media/SPtadao_zps5fd4623b.png.html)
And some sp tadao jackals stolen from the web:
(https://pure2strokespirit.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi189.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fz125%2Fmaccas125%2FSPtadao2_zps8e805a35.png&hash=942aea6ecb8ec7e31d55b410872a679b22738c88) (http://s189.photobucket.com/user/maccas125/media/SPtadao2_zps8e805a35.png.html)
I'll try and find a better picture of the pukka flanges
Dan
On the R/H pipe yours has two extra welds in the header. The header on the other pic I posted is a one piece stamped/formed jobby. The length of the stinger on the left pipe looks different too.
What I would say is they look to be made by SP tadao. The spring mounts are the same, where the cylinder flange mounts looks the same. The hanging brackets at the rear of the pipes are the same. The silencer mounting flanges look the same. DFR pipes have a strengthening sleeve that is cut at a funny angle there. OX pipes have triangular silencer brackets and they are stamped OX racing.
So, I believe SP tadao made pipes for the SPR too? I wonder if that is what we are looking at here? I'll do some more digging.
Dan
Thanks Dan, I've managed to get some pictures taken between all the major incidents at work...
I might put a post on the DS site to see if anyone there can identify them. I'm still not confident they are TZR.....
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My post on the DS site has come up with this potential gem: "si.likes.guiness wrote: they look like the dogfight r's for the nsr mc21"
Could well be. That's a bummer.
Pretty sure they aren't dogfights. They have a very distinctive sleeve near the silencer flange i'll get you a picture to show you what i mean later Yan.
Dan
Dogfight pipes have this sleeve near the silencer flange Yan. it's quite distinctive with being at an angle like that.
(https://pure2strokespirit.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi189.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fz125%2Fmaccas125%2FTZR250RSPJackalPipes008_zps3d392949.jpg&hash=b912d8567275c2bcfb2f54d3c8607c191bb5d7ca) (http://s189.photobucket.com/user/maccas125/media/TZR250RSPJackalPipes008_zps3d392949.jpg.html)
Dan
Dogfight NSR pipes here:
http://page6.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/f131607236
Totally different.
Dan
Thanks Dan. The search continues....
Yan!
*News Flash!!*
I've cracked it. They are SP Tadao pipes for a 3xv SPR 100% on this.
The SPR has a cast iron extension from the exhaust port for the standard pipes, it's about 2" long. It looks like the SP tadao pipes keep this extension in place. I have found a picture of an SPR fitted with SP tadao pipes and this cast iron extension piece is in place. I'm still not sure if you have the correct flanges, they look right but an SPR owner with the extension piece or standard pipes would have to confirm that. Here are some SP tadao SPR pipes for sale in Japan:
http://www.redbaron-parts.jp/popup/entry18626-0.html
I'd say they are the same as yours for sure.
I also found some more pictures I had saved a few years ago here:
(https://pure2strokespirit.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi189.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fz125%2Fmaccas125%2F600x450-2013050900010_zpsb72774cc.jpg&hash=f88a042cd5758c0d42905baefef0486fb755a685)
(https://pure2strokespirit.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi189.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fz125%2Fmaccas125%2F600x450-2013050900012_zpsf68887fe.jpg&hash=34e7ddce85129ec1099d86fe7b3f425971a51a48)
This last pic is of a set fitted to an SPR that I found on the old old old forum. You can see the cast iron extension piece in place. The spring loops are the same as yours and the flanges look right too.
(https://pure2strokespirit.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi189.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fz125%2Fmaccas125%2FP1050135_zps66630464.jpg&hash=d3f5dd231bcf15e9fb43935b34df9117713601f8)
So you have a choice. Sell them to an SPR owner or get a flange made up to join the pipe upto the cylinder and see how the bike works. SPR porting is quite different from 3xv30 barrel porting but you never know it might work ok?
Dan
W00t! Dan, you are a true hero. I owe you big big big time :) :D ;D
I owed you big time before this but now I am even more in your debt. I think you must have the best knowledge of TZR expansion chambers outside of Japan :P
I think it would be best if I try and sell them to a SPR owner first. They will be set up for the SPR porting and powervalves.
Happy days, some light at the end of a rough week!
OK, latest flaming barrel....
I went to bleed the autolube tonight so I could do a write up and the brass pipe that the rhs line goes on snapped off when I tried to take the oil line off. It was bent in the crash and obviously weakened. Bum.
I'm looking for a replacement however I may have a cunning repair. Watch this space for an update and for Paul to tell me to go pre-mix ;D.
Here's a picture of the snapped "brass bit" from my oil pump (bottom left) and a complete one (bottom right). As well as providing a "take off" for the smaller oil line there is a spring and ball bearing to prevent flow return (and the oil line draining back). The TZR250 one is similar in function to the RD500 but where as that is in three pieces (brass, spring and ball bearing) the TZR one is one unit with the ball and spring held captive in the tube.
A new oil pump for the '93 onwards is 189euro from CMSNL however after reading some bits on the RDLCcrazy Facebook page and having a despondent surf of the net I realised that the "brass tube" was a push fit. I had a TZR250 mechanical oil pump in my box of bits (I was considering a future retro conversion) however I removed one of the "brass tubes" and it was identical to the broken one.
(https://pure2strokespirit.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.yan.org.uk%2Fforums%2Fbuild%2Foil_pump_snap.jpg&hash=26ab508a0dd8032806533259066970b9086aca25)
So now the oil pump is fixed I have returned to bleeding the oil system. Only I have had another flaming barrel come down at me. It looks like the left solenoid is jammed and won't open/bleed correctly. However all is not lost; Dan Williams at http://www.geckomotorcycles.co.uk/ (http://www.geckomotorcycles.co.uk/) has sorted me out a second hand "solenoid rig" for a very reasonable price. Thanks Dan, you're a real gent.
Just for reference there is a guy on the RDLCcrazy forum called "Arrow" who does lovely restorations of Yamaha 2T oil pumps. He can also uprate them for bigger bore capacity/increased flow. His results look like new.
I have started to write up my comprehensive guide to TZR solenoid oil pump systems with how-to and fault finding. I am getting very knowledgeable on the subject however I think I would have preferred to have remained ignorant ::)
Nice! A bit of good luck always helps to keep going! The mechanical oil pump is certainly easier but I applaud you for tackling the solenoid version, I've had a look at the manual on bleeding the system it seems more like nuclear fusion instructions. ;D
ja, these oil pumps are proof that we are slaves to convenience
dont go premix yan, you'd spoil a good thread. lol
I've not been able to do much recently what with parents/parents-in-law popping off this mortal coil :-/
The only time I've had is to try and dry fit the tailpiece I got from RC45.
(https://pure2strokespirit.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.yan.org.uk%2Fforums%2Fbuild%2Ftailpiece_n_tapes.jpg&hash=78d32014a5d7b37f08750f20d7f25ef7cf767f47)
Which picture looks best to you guys? #2 has the front of the tail-piece line up with the tank but is the back now too droopy?
I'm still trying to sell those sweet 3XVC pipes I got mis-sold so I can afford some ones for my bike. It's looking like I might have to fab some headers as no one wants :-(.
I might get some time once the kids go back to school, assuming the mother-in-law lasts longer than 3 hours out of hospital this time. The kids could be down 75% of their grand-parents this year at this rate and it's not September yet....
No 3
At least you're still with us Yan
Sorry about the parents bud
Condolences Yan :(
Yep definitely number 3 ;)
So sorry to hear about the parents Yan.
I like the tail piece, it looks cool! 8)
No 3 mate, but you should try and lower the rear end slighty so the join at the tank is parallel - it sort of drags you eye away from the rest of the fit.
Condolences on you bereavements too buddy.
Jools
OK, so I may have some time to do some bits and pieces (famous last words).
A few questions:
1) Does anyone know if the SPR cast iron flanges will fit R/RS barrels?
2) If #1 is "they won't" has anyone got any advice on making some stubs up? Should I try local engineers? I need pipe that is 33.5mm ID 45mm OD, ideally so I can turn some O-ring grooves in one end and weld (?) some flat plate to the other.
Dan Gecko has some cast iron stubs or I could get some made up. Does anyone else have any for sale or just to borrow to measure up? I'm more than happy to pay postage to/from.
I've had no joy selling those lovely SPR pipes so I'm having to look at making them fit my RS :-\
I doubt the cast iron flanges will fit the RS cylinder, especially the exhaust shape on the cylinder side. An engineering place may be able to help remake them in alloy if you give them the cast iron one and a cylinder to match? That's similar to what I did to get R flanges made to fit SP pipes..
Are you firm on your price for them? I'm casually looking for SPR pipes but around the price these SPR jackals sold for on yahoo..
http://page18.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/w112784027
Quote from: ybk on November 28, 2014, 09:02:37 AM
Are you firm on your price for them? I'm casually looking for SPR pipes but around the price these SPR jackals sold for on yahoo.
I'll PM you, save talking dirty in public....
OK, so I think the SPR cast iron headers are a no-no due to the stud spacing exhaust shape.
I've got a mate who has a mate with a plasma cutter. The guy I know has a lathe, vertical and horizontal milling machines and can braze as well so after some discussions we think we can fabricate some headers for the Jackal pipes I have.
Over the Christmas break I've been doing some more measurements and made up a "first trial" mock header to check fit:
(https://pure2strokespirit.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.yan.org.uk%2Fforums%2Fbuild%2Fheaders.jpg&hash=dab78f894b8361aa6866b83839f4ba7d412280aa).
My measurements make the two 8mm stud holes 78mm between the centres with the centre line of the exhaust port 37mm one side and 41mm the other. The centre of the exhaust port is 7mm from the line between the stud centres. The R/RS exhaust port has a 33.5mm internal diameter.
I think I will have to angle the pipe out of the header flat plate (probably 5mm sheet steel (??)) to clear the barrel and match to the expansion chambers a bit better.
Has anyone else made up R/RS exhaust headers and got any measurements to hand? Any suggestions for the design/methodology would be gratefully received.
Shame Yan. A lot of faffing about but you're getting there.
Is it not easier to buy this ?
http://www.geckomotorcycles.co.uk/magento/parts-yamaha/yamaha-tzr250-3xv-dfr-exhaust-collars.html
Quote from: Yuri on January 06, 2015, 06:46:35 AM
Is it not easier to buy this ?
http://www.geckomotorcycles.co.uk/magento/parts-yamaha/yamaha-tzr250-3xv-dfr-exhaust-collars.html
Unfortunately not Yuri. The pipes are for the later SPR and are too short for the R/RS. Also the stud spacing is different. My headers need to be about 90mm long off the face of the barrel. Hence the poly-pipe in the picture :(
Sorry for the late response , I have a spr flange that you can borrow for measurements if needed or I can try measure them for you , pic to follow in a short while ..
I have a set of sugo's for the SPR with flanges for the 93/94 SP if you like measurements
Thanks for the offers of the SP/SPR flanges. It might be good for me to understand what sort of angles the internal "tubes" have so I can mimic them however I think the SP/SPR stud spacings are different to the R/RS.
I have measured off the R/RS barrels and the R/RS exhausts both with a set of vernier calipers and using the "gasket paper and hammer" method.
In short (if you forgive the pun) I am trying to mate R/RS barrels to the "short" late SPR pipes I have. I need a flange that matches the R/RS "off center (times two)" stud spacing with a length of exhaust pipe to meet up with the shorter late SPR expansion chambers.
Ideally I should sell these pipes and get some R/RS ones however that would leave me £400+ out of pocket. I'm hoping that this will be a cheaper option....
In my humble opinion , if I was hotting up my bike I would get custom pipes designed for my motor instead of sugo pipes . Guys like Kenny for example have proved their designs a few times . Of cos there are many pipe builders but their names skip me ATM .
Where I am I can't find anyone in my state that wants my money for custom work I want done I have to try elsewhere ::)
I got the corect sugo pipes for my SP so Edd are going to buy the SPR sugo pipes from me . Edd will install the pipes on a R model mybe you can ask him to make you sum ?
Dan Maccas has very kindly given me some Martin77 R/RS flanges to use on my "header project". I've managed to MIG some washers on them as Dan had slotted them to go on an SP. I've been looking at tube and offsets to connect them to the pipes but I need to do more measuring at the weekend.
I've given up on GRP bodywork, bitten the bullet and got some Chinese ABS ones. I say "got" but this is me. Paid 16/02 (eBay), chased why they still hadn't shipped 24/02, got this reply 25/02:
Quote
Hi,
Thank you for your purchase fairing from our shop.
Normally the fairing needs about 10 working days to finish, but because the Chinese New Year is coming, during the New Year holiday, factory workers did not work a long time.
So the fairing needs to wait till Mar-5 that it can be start to do. Can you wait for it?
Sorry about this matter bring to you, hope you understand. As your request, we will back to work as soon as possible. Please at ease !!!
Happy New Year
Looks like they paint to order, and the painters have all gone home. Is it me or is it taking the p155 just a little to take an order and then say it's going to take 17 days (plus 14 to do the work??) to get them painted before we ship them?
Just read this Yanw
I have some stainless headers that were made up a while back for the R/RS cylinders, that will take a TZ pipe internally.
I came across them the other day, if they are any use ?
Thanks Jools, i will get back to you after the weekend.
great detailed thread, some good reading here
FFS, it goes from bad to worse.
The Chinese bodywork, that took four weeks from payment to get painted before it took three weeks to get delivered arrived today.
They sent 3MA bodywork. The auction listing and all the pictures shows 3XV stuff.
I've started a dispute but I am absolutely seething.
I kinda remember someone else on a forum having this problem and sending them a book in return to cut down on the return postage costs? Was that one of you guys?
cr@p!!! what to$$ers!!
Not good, I got r1 bodywork on way and rg500 to be fair they sent me a picture of the r1 before sending
Not posted anything for a while.
I got the replacement bodywork from China, just had to pay the customs charge again.
I managed, with some Martin77 headers donated from Dan, to make some headers for the SP Tadao SPR pipes I have. Not the best welding ever but I'm doing it myself and learning while enjoying myself. Thanks Dan, you're a diamond.
(https://pure2strokespirit.net/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.yan.org.uk%2Fforums%2Fbuild%2Frs-spr_headers.jpg&hash=78d5febeac3993cb3a8d483a5a229feb732f0455)
I finally got some time to refit the carbs and airboxes (need to get me a spider-monkey to do my spannering, there is no space whatsoever) and got it to run up today. The lesson I learned today was to fit the choke plungers before putting the carbs on the rubbers.
http://www.yan.org.uk/forums/build/3xv9_runup.mp4 (http://www.yan.org.uk/forums/build/3xv9_runup.mp4)
The RHS carb is overflowing, I guess it needs a new float valve/seat and the tap was leaking a smidge. Hopefully the tap rubber will swell and I won't need to repair it.
I'll start working out the cut down subframe for the bodywork next, while I wait for parts. I got a 3XV rear light and a subframe for £40 in total. The plan is to convert it to a Sugo like brackets with enough "meat" left to hang a number plate and the light off. I've looked at other rear lights but got a 3XV one (which will fit the bodywork gap nicely and has the correct connectors) for less than a eBay/LED special.
No worries on the flanges Yan, I'm just glad you've managed to make use of the SPR pipes with them!
It sounds lovely, keep cracking on with it! I expect it will feel a bit stronger to ride with those pipes just as is but what are your plans longer term?
Happy Christmas mate!
Dan
The plan is to get it running on the road this year. Next winter is sorting the slightly scored bore, Martin77 porting, new pistons and seals/bearings. Winter after that is programmable ignition.
Well done Yan. Thought your 3xv was going to be a non-event.
Well, went for an MoT and passed first time, no advisories.
I'm off to see some paint matchers on Monday so I can get the tank and seat cowl sprayed up. Then it's just a plug chop to check if the slightly larger jets (one size each side) are OK for the new spannies.
Either way she's ready enough for the Pescott Bike Festival next month (I'm #57 for the hill climb) http://www.prescottbikefestival.co.uk/ (http://www.prescottbikefestival.co.uk/)
How does it feel with the pipes on Yan?
Dan
It sounds good Dan and pulled ok. I didn't wring it's neck as it was damp and I didn't want to drop it again so soon. When I opened it up it bogged a bit but I think that was from all the oil from bleeding the new lines. I looked in the mirrors and the cars behind were coming out of a blue fog >:D.
I bought some new plugs at the bike shop so I will take it out for chop one dry evening this week. I've done the SP airbox mod as well so I need to check the jetting.
I spent the afternoon spraying high build primer on my spare tank but I will need another tin.
I'll report back in the week.
Bloody Hell, it's on the road! Nice one Yan
Man alive, I don't know who is the most surprised, my mates, my wife, the guys at the bike shop or you lot :o ;D. You'd think it was off the road for nearly three years....
I have the tank and tail piece sprayed up now and vinyl lettering applied. It will go to have some 2-pack clear coat sprayed on Monday.
I am just now finishing off fitting the bodywork. You can make nice mirror blanks with a 20mm 6mm domed hex head, a couple of washers, a nylock nut and some 10mm/6mm clear tubing.
I've also gone out tonight I'm taxed and done a plug chop. I have done the SP mod to the upper/left airbox and I have the new pipes. I have already gone up a size from standard (I had a set with a Posh Firm box I've fitted). I think that they look OK but any advice is greatfully received. There is more colour on one side of both plugs but that could be me not getting the throttle shut quick enough perhaps?
It's getting "almost done" now. The tank and tailpiece are being picked up tomorrow from getting some 2-pack clearcoat sprayed over my "rattle can learning experience" and today I have been replacing the "China" bodywork fixings with some Dzus fasteners.
If you do buy "China" bodywork and want to bling it with some Dzus fasteners then hopefully the following notes will help out. Even if you don't go down this route you will probably need the first two items off the list to avoid having to drill out existing factory fitted Dzus back-plates:
3 x 17mm Dzus "bolts" with a nylon and securing washer. These are for the frame fitted Dzus back-plates. There is one on the RHS near the bottom rear of the front panel, one on the LHS near the bottom middle of the front panel and one to fix the bracket (see next item) to the bottom rear "finger" of the LHS front panel to the hanger that bolts to the LHS exhaust rear mount.
1 x bracket for the LHS front panel "finger" and a pop-rivet to fix it to the panel. You can order the item from Yamaha {3XV-28357-00} (~£10) however it was showing as out of stock with Fowlers. I made my own using some 1mm sheet aluminium (see picture below).
4 x 17mm Dzus "bolts" with a nylon and securing washer, Dzus back-plate and two pop-rivets. These are for the two mounting holes from upper cowl to the two front side panels.
4 x 15mm Dzus "bolts" with a nylon and securing washer, Dzus back-plate and two pop-rivets. These are for the two mounting holes in each of the two front panels that bolt onto the V-piece.
8 x M5 bodywork bolts and back-plates. You will need two to connect the V-piece to the upper cowl, four to fix the two rear panels together and maybe two to join the two front panels underneath the bike if those lugs have been added to the "China" bodywork.
I got all the bits from an eBay seller called "Trumpet Tires". The delivery time was good and the fastners are of good quality. Single "bolts" (and washers) are around £2 each and the same with a back-plate and two rivets are around £3.
Hopefully I can post up some pictures tomorrow with the bike "fully dressed".
I went to the Prescott Bike Festival today and "ran the hill" twice without falling off, or on the way there or the way home. Bumped into Dan as well which was great. Favourite bikes were a mint Bimota YB6, an OW01 (one day you will be mine, oh yes) and a Mito/YPVS hybrid. Overall a good day.
Good to see you today Yan! Thanks for the screen mate :-).
Was a good day out, some nice bikes on show including a bike with a dodge viper v10 engine!
Dan
Looking very smart Yan! 8)
I got a 3XVB with a set of JL exhausts that came off a 3XV1.
Has anyone done this before? In need of flanges / spigots as the 2 port configurations are completely different.
Even a drawing will work that I can get them made up :)
Quote from: Nico on July 23, 2024, 02:00:56 PM
I got a 3XVB with a set of JL exhausts that came off a 3XV1......
The only solution I can suggest is that you fit the exhausts to the new bike and then measure then CAD up what you need to mate them together.
I'm about to CAD, 3D print and then cast some MK3 headers for this bike but other life matters have been getting in the way. I'll post the process up in here in the future but my "swap" is the opposite way round to you.