F3 TZR

[jools]

The pipes on page 1 were the original TZR pipes that had been "gutted" with home made silencers.
This bike was basically stock and from memory ran pretty well but not exceptionally quick.

I then obtained F3 Crank, ignition & pipes from Japan. The cylinders and heads were tuned as per the F3 manual to match the rest of the kit. The F3 gear was used of unknown quality so there is a possibility of something not working correctly.

The PV controller proved to be faulty - not closing on start up which I believed was the culprit but substituting two other PV controllers into the circuit didn't really improve things.

Time has run out for the moment, but I havn't given up. I wanted tocomnpare the dimensions of the F3 pipes with the originals - I may even swap them over to see if this has any effect - but I'm planning to schedule a day on the dyno with all the different bits and pieces to try and dial it in properly.

[jools]

OK, gotta get back on the case for this as I've entered it in the PCRA Sth Circuit Rnd 4 at the end of the month.

First think to address will be installing the Modified YPVS controller and see how that changes anything. I'll be looking at initially setting it to open a bit later around 7500rpm to try and fill that hole in.

If this fails then I will try giving the static timing a bit more advance from 0.85mm to 1.0mm to see how that changes anything.

I've run out of time for any dyno tweaking so it will have to be seat of the pants work !

[jools]

Well,

quick report as thats as long as the practice session lasted !

No improvement, with mid range pickup and on this track that meant keeping the revs up with the inevitable consequences - big end failure on 2nd lap. managed to limp home to pits but once engine stopped it locked solid on the bottom end.
Hope the F3 crank isnt too badly knackered 

This will give me the impetus to sort this out once and for all, and with a rebuilt crank, rebore and nes pistons, I should be able to rule out the mechanical side of things.

one more project for summer............

[mboddy]

Sad to hear about your crank Jools. Hope you get it all sorted for PCRA 2014.

I am still coming to terms with mine.
I think I need to change the seat unit to stop me sliding back in the seat and to make sure I stay up close to the tank.
Because with the bike being so light it keeps on lifting the front - often not by a small amount either.
I ran my revs right off the tacho during one start because I couldn't get it to change up a gear when the front end was pointing at the sky.
It could probably use a little extra ride height at the back too.

Even though I fitted treaded tyres to the TDR250 yesterday I was still faster on the TDR than on the TZR which is running slicks.
The TDR initially felt really bad after only having slicks on it for about 10 years. I qualified last on the grid because I did not have confidence in the tyres.
But as the day went on I learned to be more forceful with it and now don't think the race compound Savas will slow me down at all.

But the TZR requires me not to force it. You almost only need to think about what you want it to do and it does it.

I love both bikes and it is good that they are so different.

[jools]

I agree Mark,

The TZR on those 125 slicks is telepathic. in only the two laps i did yesterday is was very confidence inspiring.
I know you have always been an advocate of the smaller width tyres and  am fast becoming a convert.

In contrast the LC with 110 front and 130 rear took some muscling around and I was having quite a few rear end slides exiting some corners on the gas until they got fully warmed up. I plan on changing the front to a 90 section and move the 110 to the back which might help with the chattering on the front end.

With the engine of the TZR I'm going to put the OEM crank and ignition back in and get it dialled in with the programmable PV controller.
The F3 ignition will go to Grant for checking while the crank is rebuilt. The I may look at some 32mm Lectrons..............

[tzr-v4]

Even though I fitted treaded tyres to the TDR250 yesterday I was still faster on the TDR than on the TZR which is running slicks.
The TDR initially felt really bad after only having slicks on it for about 10 years. I qualified last on the grid because I did not have confidence in the tyres.
But as the day went on I learned to be more forceful with it and now don't think the race compound Savas will slow me down at all.

Can you point me to the savas tires you are using ?

[mboddy]

Sava MC50 M-Racer

I was using the super-soft race compound on the front and the soft on the rear, both at 26psi. Air temperature on the day reached 26C.



http://www.savatech.eu/novelties/new-tyres/400-mc50-m-racer-new-motorcycle-tyre.html

[jools]

Who is the dealer in Aus Mark and how does the price compare ?

[mboddy]

I get all my tyres from Whites Racing Products. They are in Ingleburn.
They come to all our race meetings and support us and so I support them.
They always do me a good price. Always much cheaper than my local shops.
Give Craig a call and tell him you race with PCRA and I put you on to him.
I am sure that you will be happy with the price.
http://www.wrp.net.au

[ypm25]

Used Sava tyres before, hmm not good! 

Pirrelli Rosso 2 on a 2.75 and 3.5" rim, very good

[mboddy]

Used Sava tyres before, hmm not good! 

Pirrelli Rosso 2 on a 2.75 and 3.5" rim, very good

The Sava are not well made like the Bridgestone slicks.
But they are available in a soft race compound.
Are the Pirrellis available in a soft race compound?

[ypm25]

I don't think so, but they are new modern tyre and they cut it on the race track this year. The  treaded tyre trend in YPMs this year was Pirelli Rossi 2 font and rear, or Bridstone BT090 front and Dunlop 209gp on the rear. Both combos would give good lap times just depended on the rider what they liked.

However if I could try anything... I heard the 125 racers are saying the biggest advantage the moto3s had in the British champs was the tyres. I'd check that out...

The savas were tried out in the YPMs last year or the year before with no good results. I dont think the tyres are even round, hard to balance and vibration at the front. Most people only did a lap then binned em.

[Toop]

What size do you use?

110/70/17 in the front but the back starts at 150 I think ?

[jools]

Update

since the powers that be (MA) have decided that the 250 production class will be just that next year with std wheels & road tyres etc, and no SP or F3 parts will be allowed I will be removing all the F3 parts and restoring the bike back to standard.

Bit of a bummer really as I never got to see how it would go, but it does mean I don't have to fork out for a F3 crank rebuild just yet - am I glad I didn't by all the TZ parts to do it !!

It will then be sold on to provide cash towards a new set of TZ750 crankcases................

[mboddy]

Bummer Jools. Anything you want to swap for?
I have committed too far to back out now. So I will be going all out to turn mine into a TZ beater.
And the TDR250 that was also P6 250 Proddy is being raced in the P6 500 class this year.
So it will get some extra go as well.