SUGO CDI for Borut... (ignition curves)

[41juergen]

I'm from Germany close to Frankfurt am Main.
I would not need any de-restriction box (like the Posh box, m-max box, etc.) as I'm using the OEM clocks in the loom. With that I already tested the -10 and -40 box. You need to follow a procedure (similar like what happens when you start the engine in the bike) and than need to make sure that the speedometer is set to approx. 60 km/h before reving up. If you don't follow that procedure you can see the engine rev limited at 11500 rpm.
I got the data for the igintion mapping, PV and air solenoids with using the TPS. I think its also possible to take the data out of the 4DP / 4TW boxes (from what I believe the 4TW was the switch from leaded to unleaded) of course with the PJ instead of the air solenoids. The only question mark will be: what is the reference ignition timing e.g. at any specific rpm, for the 3XV I have 21° BTDC at 1300 rpm.
@Yuri: a -00 box would be also fine to compare to the -40 box
@ Neal: don't worry after the season is pre the season, so whenever it fit's for you.... 

[Paul]

I think its also possible to take the data out of the 4DP / 4TW boxes (from what I believe the 4TW was the switch from leaded to unleaded) of course with the PJ instead of the air solenoids. The only question mark will be: what is the reference ignition timing e.g. at any specific rpm, for the 3XV I have 21° BTDC at 1300 rpm.

4DP is also 21, or that's what it measures out to with a timing light for the ignitech.
Let me know if you want me to do anything.

[41juergen]

So that means I can also do the 4DP / 4TW's if somebody would send the box...

[41juergen]

Here is the first file, its the data from the 3XV-10 CDI. As Louis has shown for the 3MA also the 3XV CDI doesn't do a interpolation between values but "jumps" from 1 line to the next one. So the ignition and PV is not a "real" map between the throttle positions but ignition / PV data for a range of TPS. The air solenoids are operating simultaniously, means air solenoid #1 and #2 open and close at the same time (for the -40 CDI it is different, every cylinder has its own mapping...).

[Yuri]

Nice
It must be extremely restricted sp porting and 36mm carbs at 45hp

[Paul]

That's amazing
What's the raw data look like?

So that means I can also do the 4DP / 4TW's if somebody would send the box...

I don't have a spare box for you right now.

[41juergen]

May be the trick are the "restriction" blades in the air box rubber. I made a simulation with the restriction blades and without, see the data (with the Jackal pipes as I don't have the correct exhaust pipe data of the 3XV-5 bike). The data cover the SP engine spec incl. cylinder, head and crankcase geometry as well as the 36mm carbs and the shown stock ignition and PV data.
The curve shows the HP (black and green line) and torque (red and blue line) at the crank for 1 cylinder. So take it 2 times minus approx. 12% loss for the gearbox, chain and tire than you are at rwhp.
@Paul: sorry don't get you, what do you mean with "raw data look like"?

[Paul]

I'm just curious as to how you capture data from the equipment and what the data looks like.

[Warwick]

This looks like a really interesting project Jeurgen! I don't currently have an -80 box but have a -70 box I could send over for examination. But as we are coming to the summer we'd need to arrange a fairly quick turnaround so that it's not away for too long. How long do you need them for to read them?

[41juergen]

@Paul: I just setup the whole loom with all sensors and the CDI connected. Than I ramp up the revs of the electro motor and have a stroboscope lobe to flash the degree wheel which is mounted in front of the rotor. I also have a data logger connected to show the exact revs, TPS and PV position. Than I ran through the rev steps with changing the TPS from 0 - 100%.
@Warwick: I would beed may be 2 days to do the testing (depending on the other work at home defined by my Mrs...  )

[Yuri]

CDI's have been send !

[maccas]

Really interesting data from the 3xv-10 cdi juergen! I had no idea that the TPS had an effect on the PV curve. Those clever Japanese!

I'm impressed to say the least, well done.

Dan

[Paul]

@Paul: I just setup the whole loom with all sensors and the CDI connected. Than I ramp up the revs of the electro motor and have a stroboscope lobe to flash the degree wheel which is mounted in front of the rotor. I also have a data logger connected to show the exact revs, TPS and PV position. Than I ran through the rev steps with changing the TPS from 0 - 100%.

That's so bloody clever!!!!

[Neal]

It's called Vorsprung Deutsch technik !

[jools]

So much for 20 year old pieces of crap..............